Fifty years ago near-sighted Bible prophecy watchmen were telling everyone that would read their books or listen to their teaching that Gog was about to invade Israel. Hal Lindsey in his book, The Late Great Planet Earth (1970), thought the Soviet Union would fulfill the prophecy by the early 1980’s. Even before 1960 Jack Van Impe was saying that the Gog Russian invasion was imminent. Van Impe also identified Russia with the forces of the Soviet Union. These Bible prophecy watchmen were wrong.
I understand their exuberance back then. The Soviet Union of fifty and sixty years ago certainly had the military forces to fulfill the prophecy. However, some ducks were not lined up right and NATO was strong. They would not have allowed the Soviet Union to march into Israel. Not to mention that Turkey was in NATO and the Shaw of Iran was being supported by the US and was pro West. There were other reasons why the tribulation wars could not have taken place that soon. Nevertheless, irrationally exuberant Bible prophecy watchmen thought the second coming was before 1988 so they made the Gog invasion happen before that time in their teaching.
Once again, irrationally exuberant Bible prophecy watchmen are all over the wall saying Gog is coming! Russia is coming! or even Turkey is coming! I have to say, Whoa! Hold your horses! Wait a minute! Take a deep breath! Time out!
Yes, some things have changed that seem to be setting the stage for the alignment of nations mentioned in Ezekiel 38 and 39 but let’s not continually get the cart before the horse. The Bible prophecy watchmen that think Gog is coming in the next few years will also be proven wrong.
It stands to reason that if Gog invades Israel within the next two decades we would have to start to see the building of this alliance very soon. So, that should not surprise anyone. Even so, the fulfillment of Ezekiel 38 and 39 cannot happen for at least another decade.
For being Bible prophecy literalists, these watchmen really overlook a lot of small print written in Ezekiel 38 and 39. I am not saying that these Bible prophecy watchmen are intentionally misleading people. I think they have good motives. They just seem to be irrationally exuberant. They think any signs of an Ezekiel 38 tribal alignment means the Rapture will come and take us Christians away by next Christmas.
Let me first point out what I think are major key points and the scriptures about those points and then I will go into more detail on each of them.
1. Gog will be turned around.
Eze 38:4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:
Eze 38:5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:
Eze 38:6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee.
Eze 38:7 Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them.
2. Israel will be at rest and will feel secure.
Eze 38:11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,
Eze 38:14 Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?
3. Gog will have a very huge army.
Eze 38:9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.
Eze 38:15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:
Eze 38:16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.
Eze 39:12 And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.
Eze 39:13 Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified, saith the Lord GOD.
4. Gog will come to carry off a spoil
Eze 38:10 Thus saith the Lord GOD; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:
Eze 38:12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.
Eze 38:13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?
1. Gog will be turned around.
Apparently, the Gog army was already assembled for some other reason. I think it was fighting a war or at least it was prepared for a major war. The idea to invade Israel came into Gog’s mind and his military forces were turned around. Hooks were put in Gog’s jaws. In other words, invading Israel was not what Gog was intending to do with this army before something happened that changed his thinking.
Putin thinks the collapse of the Soviet Union was a big mistake and he wants to form a new confederation of nations led by Russia. What may evolve could be something like the old Warsaw Pack but with even more allies.
NATO cannot even fight ISIS. Without the U.S. there is nothing that will stop Russia from dominating much of East Europe. Pro Russian factions are rising again in Eastern Europe. The western nations of the EU know this so they intend to form a European army that is totally under the control of Western Europe. They will, but it will take time. Meanwhile, Russia looks west.
I think Russia will once again start expanding its influence toward Western Europe and I think she will establish a new strategic pact. This is not going to happen overnight. It will take years and there will be civil wars in East Europe that will help bring this about. The first step is now underway. Russia is taking over the areas of neighboring nations where there are a lot of ethic Russians. I do not even rule out that Russia will extend her influence all the way to Germany like the original Soviet Union.
2. Israel will be at rest and feeling secure.
That certainly is not possible without some peace agreement with all the nations around them and that will take some time under the best of circumstances. Of course, the “covenant with many” of Daniel 9 could bring the peace but that is not even on the horizon yet. And if the peace covenant starts with the seven-year covenant confirmed by a person that becomes the Antichrist, then the Gog invasion cannot be a pre tribulation war like most of these Bible prophecy watchmen teach.
I think the actual peace covenant starts some number of years before the confirmation of it mentioned in Daniel 9:27. That peace agreement is not on the horizon yet and Israel cannot be at rest and feeling secure before it happens.
3. Gog will have a very huge Army.
The Soviet Union of the 1980’s had a force of about 5 million men. Russia’s military is about a sixth of that today and it is the same story with their military equipment. Russia would have to call up its reserves to even put more than ten thousand fighting men into the Middle East today. Especially with their troops being tied up in East Europe.
The U.S. at the peak of its power with a coalition of 28 nations put 670,000 troops together to fight Iraq in Desert Storm. We even had to call up our reserves to accomplish that. How could Russia form such a mighty army today?
Russia’s age heavy demographics do not allow for a large peace time army anymore and Russia really is struggling financially because of low world energy prices. That will have to change before Russia can draft a large army and support them. More likely, to form this army they will form a coalition of many nations like back in the days of the Warsaw Pact. That will take time.
The cloud coming against Israel like a flood to cover the land probably is millions of troops. It takes everyone in Israel seven months to just bury most of Gog’s army. This is not talking about 50,000 men, it is talking about millions. It would take years to build up such a coalition of forces. Like I said, back in the days of the Soviet Union there was such an army north of Israel but today there is no such force.
We will have years of lead time before such an army even becomes a possibility. Even so, Israel still does not see this force as a threat to them or they would not be feeling secure. I think the Gog expansion toward West Europe must take place first.
The wording says that all the army will be splendidly equipped. Turkey is not splendidly equipped and today it cannot even defeat the Kurd’s controlling East Turkey. Sudan, and Libya are military basket cases; they cannot come against Israel. And Iran thinks it has been given a green light to become a nuclear state. Iran is not about to risk its nuclear program to come against Israel now.
4. Gog will come to carry off a spoil.
If it is about Islam, why does Gog come down to take a spoil, cattle and goods? Maybe it is because the main army was fighting north of Israel in Europe and a cold winter in Russia and Europe made Gog realize that he needed to make a change of plans for the winter to feed his army.
Gog turns his army south toward Israel to get a spoil and convinces other nations mentioned in Ezekiel 38 to join with him (they actually end up fighting each other). Perhaps, Tarshish and the young lions mentioned in Ezekiel question if Gog comes to carry off goods because they know that Gog still has a battle to fight against their forces in Western Europe. Perhaps Gog thought that Israel would be easy pickings and that his allies would occupy North Africa and the Middle East in this world war. Instead his armies met their destruction in Israel.
Bible prophecy watchmen on the wall.
Bible prophecy watchmen with their newspaper exegesis have flaws even if they seem to have good intentions. I think all astute Christians will use some newspaper exegesis at times but we do have to stick to the script given in Bible prophecy.
I know that watching the Bible prophecy watchmen can be interesting. I enjoy it. They will keep you informed on news that you will not get from MSM but don’t buy into everything that these watchmen are selling. The wall beats standing on a soapbox.
Contrary to what some Bible prophecy watchmen are teaching there is about zero possibility that Gog can come against Israel with such a mighty army within the next ten years.
The real threat for the next decade is the continuing fall into immorality, other wars, terrorism, police states, rule by tyrants, politically correct speech police, economic collapse, riots, the rise of the Harlot, persecution of Christians, drug use, internment camps, a cashless society, famine, resistant diseases, the destruction of gender identities, the destruction of the family, the destruction of nation states, deceptions from outer or inner space, genetic engineering, spiritualism (occult secret arts) and the likelihood of critical infrastructure failure.
The clearest sign that judgment is coming on the world within the next two decades is the genetic crossing of species that is already underway. However, Bible prophecy watchmen generally are not talking about that.
God will not allow his created human being image bearers to become trans-humans. The breakthrough in gene splicing is allowing humans to combine their DNA with animals and these are also being crossed with other animals and insects. Species are crossing barriers that God set up for good reason. Thousands of laboratories are already involved in genetic manipulation and with the recent breakthrough with CRISPR gene editing technology it will now take place in basements and garages.
Jesus said it would be like in the days of Noah just before His coming. Before the flood, flesh on earth was being corrupted by fallen angels. The demonically inspired science of today with their belief in evolution makes it possible and acceptable to genetically cross species again. They think they can help man evolve. This crossing of species is the clearest sign that God will soon put a stop to the corruption of His creation.
Instead of selling a “Danger! no trespassing sign!” to the scientists and the billionaires that are carrying out and funding these genetic experiments toward trans-humanism, Bible prophecy watchmen want to sell “a keep off the grass sign” to whomever they think is Gog.
Russia really is not intending to invade Israel, nor is Turkey. Turkey hopes to join the EU by next decade. The destruction of Gog’s army really is a sign to the Jews. God’s intervention against the unexpected invasion from the north restores Israel’s faith in Yahweh. That is why the timing of the Gog invasion and other details about that event will not be clear to Israel or totally clear to Bible prophecy watchmen before that idea is placed in Gog’s mind.
Don, I know you had a topic on Gog possibly being the antichrist. Is it possible that Gog is the one who makes the 7yr covenant then breaks it 3.5 yrs later? I know Ezekiel doesn’t mention Gog in the temple or anything, but maybe he and his armies are destroyed by Jesus’ Second Coming? Probably quite a stretch. Anyway thanks again.
I really don’t think so. The Antichrist comes out of the ten horns on the Beast. The Beast rises out of the Mediterranean Sea area. So Gog would have to take over most of the area of the old Roman Empire for that to be even a remote possibility. Not to mention that the Antichrist comes to kill the two prophets, kill Jews, to set himself up in the Temple as God and to stop the Lord’s return. There is not a hint of that being the reason for Gog coming in Ezekiel. There are many other reasons why Gog is not the Antichrist figure.
The more time goes by the longer I think we have to wait. A lot of what has to happen such as gogs invasion or Babylon as a great world city will probably take a few decades.
I think Gog may attack Israel because Israel will be a part of the European/Mediterranean superstate. Perhaps there will be a war between Gogs forces and this state. It allows Israel to feel secure being part of a much larger EU force and it gives more reasoning for Gog to attack. I’m unsure if this battle will be before the tribulation or during it…ik you were pondering this question also Don.
Lastly, maybe the 2nd coming won’t happen between 2030 to 2035 like we think. Maybe the church age ends around this time instead?
One last thought.
I know 2520 is a number used a few times in the Bible. 457 BC was given the command to restore Jerusalem. 2520 years later would be the year 2063 AD ( give or take a couple years due to the calenders). Plus, if Usher was 60 years off of his dating wouldn’t that put the end of the age around this time? Something to think about.
I see no reason to use the 2520 year number from 457 BC that seems to be the Adventist position. Even if there were a reason would you use the 360 day lunar year or the solar year? The logical year to start the 2520 years would be 536 BC. Grant Jeffrey pointed out that it ended in 1948 when Israel became a nation using 360 day lunar years.
Dr. Thomas Ice explains the three decrees and why number three in 444BC applies.
https://www.raptureready.com/featured/ice/70-weeks-5.html.
Because of the Genetic corruption now taking place among other things. I simply do not think mankind can go on for another 50 years before the Revelation Judgments.
One more thing, if Terah was actualy 130 years old when Abraham was born instead of the 70 that Ussher used, and the seven thousand year week is valid, the dating should be adjusted for the end of the fourth day. In other words, the end of the fourth day would have been around 28 AD when Jesus announced the acceptable year of the Lord and not 1996AD. Then 2000 years from 28 AD brings the end of the sixth day to around 2028.
I try to explain it in this article.
http://www.thepropheticyears.com/reasons/The%20age%20is%20almost%20over.htm
I had to read your post a few times to understand what you were saying, but I understand now. The 60 years would be added before Christ was born instead of adding them on to 1996 AD. I can’t argue with that, I guess time will tell
Yeah, Jesus ended the forth day. Then two thousand years of grace (two days) and then the millennial reign where Jesus rules the earth with a rod of iron.
This resounds in me as truth. thank you, Don
Don,
I just thought something that may or may not support your view of the rapture being 10.5 years before the 2nd coming.
The old testament era ended with John and the church age didn’t start until Pentecost roughly 3.5 years later. Perhaps the Church age will also end 3.5 years before the tribulation period.
In sure a lot of things could happen during this 3.5 years like the Gog invasion. I think we can surmise that the church will be gone by the end of this war. I think it can’t be mid trib either cause how will Israel bury bones when they are being hunted in warfare conditions?
Don, is there any idea how long the genetic corruption lasted before the Lord spoke to Noah? I also read somewhere that God gave Noah 100 years to build the ark, or maybe that’s just how long it took to build it. Thanks.
It lasted long enough to corrupt most flesh on earth. However, today all flesh could be corrupted very quickly by just forcing people to take something.
Jim,
Nobody has been able to definitively define when the Gog invasion takes place. There are problems with every timing.
Hi, I have a few questions about following verses:
(9): And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years: [King James Version, Ez 39]
(10): So that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down [any] out of the forests; for they shall burn the weapons with fire: and they shall spoil those that spoiled them, and rob those that robbed them, saith the Lord GOD. [King James Version, Ez 39]
1. Are these events after the reset of the civilization (Gog will attack Israel with using the classical weapon)?
2. Is it possible to burn the modern weapon in the ordinary fire?
3. I don’t remember exactly but I think that this wood (from weapon) will be use for burnt offerings in the rebuilt millennial temple.
Don, would you say that fallen angels are at work with our governments today perhaps providing this information technology, or do you think man has been able to develop this on his own? You would think the angels learned their lesson the first time around.
Most think that wording is metaphoric and what they will be burning for seven years will be the fuel of this army. I guess it is possible that this literally could occur after all modern weapons of warfare have been used up in a world war. More likely there will be a lot of sulfuric acid or methane or something else corrosive in the atmosphere caused by some comet. This could destroy modern electronics and metal weapons it also could cause the famine.
Having said that, do keep in mind that the people this scripture was given to and the early translators of it would not understand modern terms. For example, the word for bows would be the same as the word for launchers (rocket launchers) and the word for arrow would be the same as a modern missile.
The Contemporary English Version Bible says:
Hi Steve, I missed your comment.
I do not think Satan’s angels are openly working with governments as angels. I think God keep all angels on a leash, they can only do what God allows.
Certain angels are called watchers because they watch and report to God. If they go beyond what God allows them to do, it would bring about a war in Heaven and Satan and his angels would be cast out.
I do not think that kind of deception will be allowed until God allows it for the purpose of the great deception during the tribulation. At that point Satan and his angels have been cast out and are bound to the earth.
Satan obviously influences those that are blinded by him. And evil spirits do deceive humans that practice any occultism that God forbids or that believe satanic false prophets.
Don, are you saying you don’t think the Rapture will happen for many more years?
Hi Angie,
No, the Rapture is always imminent. We simply do not know how much time, if any, will exist between the Rapture of the Bride and the start of the last seven years. Enoch was taken alive to Heaven over a half of a life span before the flood judgment and a life span was a very long time back then.
Forgive me, I should have read your article on the seven-day theory and the other comments before I asked.
It does make me very grieved to think of all our eyes would have to see before the Rapture would happen.
Don,
In response to your last comment about not using 457 BC, but 536 BC for the 2520 years….
2520 years of 360 day years from 457 BC is actually 2028 AD. That’s 2000 years from when Jesus preached the acceptable year of our Lord like you mentioned. How weird is that? A coincidence? It’s also 70 years from 1948.
Its interesting but on the last point you get no cigar because 70 years from 1948 is 2018.
Oops my bad Don….
“Its interesting but on the last point you get no cigar because 70 years from 1948 is 2018.”
But therein may lie your 10.5 years?
Nah! My 10.5 year scenario is from the opening of the first seal (it possibly could also include the Rapture) until the second coming.
I say that the last seven years is the last week of years dealing with Israel so the seven years starts with the sealing of the 144,000 Jews and the ministry of the two prophets. (God always sends his prophets to Israel before judgment.)
The first seals do not seem to be directed at Israel at all. In fact, they seem to be man caused and are not divine judgments of God carried out by angels. The persecution against God’s people at the fifth seal may actually bring the wrath of the Lamb followed by the wrath of God after Israel is attacked.
Actually, there could be any number of years from the opening of the first seal and possibly the Rapture of the Church until the signing of the 7 year Covenant. Maybe that is why many in Israel say the Lord delays His coming and they go back to their same old ways.
Don, I was brought up believing the church would be in heaven before the first seal is opened. I remember you said in one of your articles you thought the rapture might be between the fourth and fifth seals. I’m not taking a position because I don’t know but this is what I’m wondering.
If the rapture is anytime after the first seal/seals; how would we know if the first seal hasn’t already been opened?
I as most everyone else don’t really know when the Rapture will occur. Most Christians with Amillennial Theology think the rider on the white horse is Jesus and he has been riding since Pentecost. I do not hold that position but I also do not know why the Church needs to know when the first seal was opened anyway.
Hi Don, I’ve been an avid reader of your blog for years, and so appreciate your recent return to writing again! Thank You for your love and passion of God’s Word and for your rational and knowledgeable perspectives. Dr. Andy Woods recently (past few weeks) published a short book titled “Middle East Meltdown” covering Ezekiel 38 and 39. Dr. Woods presented a view that I have not heard before (that he credits to one of his teachers in seminary). He also outlined the various other perspectives that have been presented and discusses possibly why this battle doesn’t fit into those time lines. Dr. Woods had a YouTube Q&A video hangout this past week discussing some of the topics covered in the book if anyone is interested:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQs15240IDg
I’ve been on the fence in timing of all these events and have been slowly drawing the conclusion that the Rapture is indeed imminent, and can happen at anytime. The 7 year Tribulation doesn’t necessarily follow the Rapture immediately, it’s start could be delayed by several years following the Rapture. If Dr. Woods “7th” view presented in his book is accurate, then Ezekiel 38 and 39 would occur “after” the Rapture. If the start of those final 7 years are indeed delayed, then your approximate 10 year timelines are all very accurate! This is very exciting to me! What a time to be alive!
I cannot watch the video right now because I do not have the bandwidth, I wrote my Revelation commentary in 2004 and used that 10.5 year timeline. One of the prime reasons is that they would be burning the weapons for seven years. I thought it was exactly seven years for good reason. They would have to flee to the mountains for the last 3.5 years.
I wrote about my position about 7 years ago in the following article.
http://www.thepropheticyears.com/wordpress/positions-on-the-ezekiel-38-39-war-and-the-rapture.html
I listened to the link and I agree with Wood that Ezekiel 38 and 39 covers the time from the Gog invasion until the restoration of the Kingdom. Ezekiel 36 and 37 also covers a long period of time that ends with the restoration of Israel. The difficulty in Ezekiel 39 is in determining where what is written about Gog ends. The rest then is briefly referring to Armageddon and the spiritual restoration of Israel. When you get into Ezekiel 40 – 48 Israel is in the millennium.
I do think people are missing the main point of my article since nobody has even addressed it. Many Bible prophecy watchmen now claim that Gog is coming, like the stage is now all set and we are just waiting for the big invasion of Israel. However,for the reasons I gave in the article, I do not think the Gog war is even possible for at least another decade.
Thanks again for another great article Don! I’ve been discussing this topic with some friends lately, and you helped me get a better grasp on the entire situation yet again. The cogs certainly are moving, but it does look to be quite some time before Gog is “ready” and even that term is kind of loose because they don’t even intend to go after Israel at first, as you also said.
God Bless.
Prophetically speaking, Gog represents Satan and Magog represents his followers. This invasion of Israel takes place during the first 3.5 years of the seven year the tribulation period after the rapture of the few who are taken out as the Bride of Christ. Not all Christians are the Bride of Christ. Multitudes of Christians will remain on the earth for a time of testing in order to ‘wash their robes white”. The Gog war comes after the rapture of the most faithful bride.
The two prophets are giving their testimony for the first half of the last seven years, so I do not think Gog will be invading Israel at that time.
“Not all Christians are the Bride of Christ”?? That statement is an oxymoron if you are talking about those born into the body of Christ. Maybe you mean that not all that identify as Christians actually believe in Him? Unbelievers are not born from above into His spiritual body but don’t confuse unbelievers with the Church.
All true Christians have their robes washed in the the blood of the Lamb. It is what Jesus did to save us not what we do to save ourselves. I suggest that you read the scriptures of Paul. He gives salvation doctrine to the Bride.
Don, thank you for the archive link. Excellent study. Gog is noted in the Biblical text of Ezekiel as you’ve included in this article. Gog is also mentioned in Revelation 20. Since these two events span roughly 1000 years (i.e. the Millenium), then to my mind that leads me to believe that Gog is a supernatural figure because human’s don’t live 1000 years. I also remember reading somewhere that Gog is also mentioned in the first verse of Amos 7 if you’re reading from the Septuagint. The “chief prince of Meschech and Tubal” Gog is the primary influencer and great deceiver behind the Ezekiel 38 battle participants against Israel. That places Gog as a minion and associate of Satan’s on a very high power level much like the archangels Michael and Gabriel. This battle’s player are coming into play in this day and age… so I do see things aligning with Bible Prophecy. As implied in my previous response, I see this battle occurring after the Rapture. I also see the possibility of a wide gap in years between the Rapture and the start of the 7 year tribulation. It’s not clear to me if the time it takes to “cleanup and bury” the bodies is due to the shear volume of men in the attacking armies, or if the long time might be due to the dangerous radioactive fallout from what could be a tactical nuclear battle initially, or the large volume of treacherous land obstacles that have rained down from the heavens… this battle is “obviously” supernaturally won by God using an earthquake, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. I believe this battle is what opens Israel’s currently blind eyes.
Tom,
Actually, the first time Gog is mentioned in the Bible he was the grandson of Joel. Magog was the son of Jepheth who was the son of Noah. I think we are looking at tribal identities here that are descendants of these men.
The Septuagint In Amos 7:1 just infers that Gog is a king of locusts that come from the the east against Israel. Besides, the scripture context makes it clear that it was fulfilled in the days of ancient Israel in the days of king Jeroboam.
Can you show me from scripture where Gog is some supernatural identity?
At the end of the millennial reign Gog and Magog are mention again when people come against the saints at Jerusalem. However, the detail is clearly saying that they come from locations on the earth. Gog and Magog may just be like saying they come from the North and East.
Just read an article on Zero Hedge that fits this topic. Article is pro-Russian so biased but gives detail that Don has written on. American weakness and idiocy in world affairs is emphasized and exaggerated (maybe with tongue in cheek sarcasm directed at those thinking America is great and cannot be bested) but will create more balance than reading the crap coming from MSM.
“Don’t Think Armageddon, Think “A Thousand Balls Of Flame… And Then Crickets!”
Don, you said, “… zero possibility that Gog can come against Israel with such a mighty army within the next ten years.”
That is really depressing. That means the Rapture is a long ways off.
My view that the Gog invasion is at least 10 years in the future does not mean the Rapture is a long way off. The Rapture is not the Gog invasion. The timing of the Lord’s coming for His Church is unknown and imminent. Each of us could be taken in a heartbeat anyway as all Christians before us. We are told to occupy until He comes, we have work to do right here until He does. If you find that depressing, you need to have a change of mind.
Don asks… “Can you show me from scripture where Gog is some supernatural identity?”
No Don, I can’t show you that. My conclusion that Gog is a “supernatural person” comes from my read that Gog represents a person in Ezekiel 38, and that person’s life spans a long time in years based on the “bookends” of Gog mentioned in Scripture. However, after reading Rev 20 again with your “clue” that the Gog and Magog reference there could be directional in it’s use (and possibly referring to the at-that-time in Scripture previous historical Ezekiel 38 battle attacker origins). Thank you for the gentle nudge towards that perspective. I’m continually shattering my previous understandings of Scripture that have built into my mind some incorrect assumptions and mis-understandings. Thank You!
Tom,
I was not suggesting that Ezekiel 38 already happened in the past or that Gog is not an actual identity of a leader. I was just saying that Gog and Magog were grandsons of Noah and they settled at a location on the earth. Gog is also an identity of the leader of the land of Magog.
Gog and Magog are the leader and the people that occupy a land north and east of Israel that come against Israel. This was true in Amos 7 in the Septuagint and it is also true in Ezekiel 38 and 39 and it is true at the end of the millennium. There could be a spirit being behind Gog but Gog is the human leader and the people that follow Gog. Gog is not a spiritual being.
Don, I just want to address your response to Garlex. Do you ever wonder why people read your blog? Have you considered why God asks us to be watchful? Have you ever asked yourself why prophecy is such a complex puzzle, designed to be searched and studied? I believe the popularity of your blog is due to the desire of believers wanting to connect with their brethren and to find solid Biblical perspective in the study of the times we’re in. And judging from comments left on your blog over the years, many of us, your brethren, are tired. We are weary. We are on your blog because we are watchful. And why is that? Because our Lord commanded it, and because we are desperate for our Father’s return. Its behind every, “come quickly Lord Jesus!”
Americans may not be physically persecuted as they are in other countries (yet). But here, in the US, our sorrow is very real. Our loneliness is palpable. We struggle to find churches that adhere to Biblical truths. We cannot find other “Christians” who will tolerate sound doctrine or someone who is sincerely seeking to comprehend it. Should we be aware that we were appointed by God to live during this revolutionary time period? Yes. Should we be strong and courageous? Of course. Should we seek His glory with every breath we take and stop considering our own selves and our own anguish? No doubt about it. But I will tell you that, like Garlex, I’m tired. I’m human. And I’m so anxious to be taken from this insanity and isolation. Waiting another day for the bridegroom is like agony to me lately. As I write this I weep, literally, and I weep for my teenagers. And while you may be stronger and in a better place emotionally and spiritually, I wanted to remind you that you have weaker brethren and to encourage you to encourage them. You serve God and God is love. “Love is patient, love is kind….,” “be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous…,” “By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.”
All I ask is that, as we travel this road together, as believers, that we remember to show mercy and love toward one another. Thank you, Don, for your Godly insights and knowledge and for taking the time to share them. To Garlex, I want to say that I relate to you. And personally I do not agree that you need a change of mind. It sounds to be like you need to be encouraged and reminded that our Lord will come. We cannot know when, but He is coming. And He doesn’t “need” us to do anything. His Will will be accomplished with or without us. But in anticipation of His coming, and in the overwhelming love we have for Him, we can comfort one another in love and we can share His message through our words and actions every day. We don’t need to go to Hungary or the Yukon or China to do this. We can do this right here, right now, at this very moment.
Hi Julie,
I agree with most of what you said but I think you missed the point. Just because I said the Gog invasion is over 10 years off does not mean the Rapture cannot occur tomorrow. So there really is nothing on that point to be depressed about. Now, if I had said the tribulation was starting this September and we will still be here that would be something to be depressed about.
I am not saying that the fallen world is not a pretty depressing place but until the Lord comes Christians are to occupy. That means working in the field and letting the light that we have shine. Not doing that will lead to a world depression for sure.
By the way, what you said was well said, but if you do not use paragraphs few will attempt to read it. There are ways to add line feeds even with mobile devices. People need to google it and find out how for their own device if they have not already figured it out.
The directive to “occupy” is the only reason I have the determination to head in to the work place and deal with the brood of vipers on a daily basis – and the vipers are getting worse.
I prefer to think of mission and duty versus being depressed about the clearly foretold and prophetic end-times we find ourselves in.
I wish we knew more details about what happens to America. The best I’ve got to work with is Don’s list: http://www.thepropheticyears.com/comments/Imminent%20Danger%20to%20the%20United%20States%20of%20America.htm
Don – on a side note, clearly related to this blog — on “raptureready” there is a similar post about “Gog” – but, the author is one of those that thinks Gog is right around the corner — it’s the latest “Nearing Midnight” post of August 29 by “Terry” (I think he [or she] needs to read this blog page to get some education, IMO).
Don,
This is a bit off topic but is still related to the end times events. You don’t do your monthly perspectives anymore so I’m not sure where to post.
Anyway, in regards to Babylon being rebuilt and destroyed, where in the Bible does it actually say Babylon has to be in the exact spot it was before? From what I read it just says in the plains of Shinar.
The plain of Shinar is fairly big and encompasses the city of Baghdad all the way down to Bozrah. Why can’t one of these cities be renamed New Babylon and renovated? The evil spiritual powers behind ancient Babylon are the same no matter what geographical location it is in. As for Babylon being destroyed , I see no error in ancient Babylon being abandoned and new Babylon being the one being utterly destroyed.
That is entirely possible. Babylon was a kingdom as well as a city. We should keep in mind that capitols often are not the largest cities.
I do think they will at least symbolically set up a Government headquarters and/or a religious Temple in the city of Babylon where it all began. The city of Babylon also was never totally destroyed as the prophets said, so it must be.
As for being off or on topic, You could have found a thread more appropriate on this blog if you looked. For example.
https://www.thepropheticyears.com/enddepravity/satans-progressive-control-freaks-create-babylon-2-0.html
The place to send stuff where there is no approprate place to comment is my email address. Even so, it fits here good enough.
Hi Don,
Since Babylon has been brought up, what do you think about the theory that the Babylon spoken of in Revelation is in fact Jerusalem? Chris White, with whom I disagree with on much of his eschatology, has produced a series of podcasts that offer compelling support for this theory.
Have I drifted too far off-topic?
Doug
Yeah, we are getting off topic for this post. In fact, thus far we have hardly been on topic for what I wrote about at all.
Babylon is spoken about in many places in the Bible. It almost always refers to the area on the plains of Shinar between the two great rivers or the city or kingdom of Babylon.
It is true that Jerusalem was called spiritual Babylon in one place in scripture but that spiritual metaphor was used because Jesus was crucified by Satanic forces at Jerusalem. Physical Babylon was always in Babylon.
I wrote many pages explaining all the scriptures on Babylon in my Revelation Commentary in chapter 18. I recommend that anyone that wants deeper understanding of Babylon read it.
http://www.thepropheticyears.com/The%20book%20of%20Revelation/Revelation%20Chapter%2018.htm
Don, on August 25, 2016 at 11:51 am You wrote:
“Most think that wording is metaphoric and what they will be burning for seven years will be the fuel of this army […]”
Whether the following verse is implying that it isn’t a metaphor?
(20): Thus ye shall be filled at my table with HORSES and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD. [King James Version, Ez 39]
I did not say the prophecy is a metaphor. I said that most futurist teachers think the arms they will be burning is a metaphor for the fuel of that army.
I did not say that I believe that. I said that I think it is possible that modern metal weapons might not be usable in that campaign.
With the recent US pull out of Syria, the calls that Gog are coming very soon, are back. While I think it does show a significant shift in US policy, I just remember all your discussions on the topic saying this force is still going to take some time. Just not exactly sure when of course. But as in all things God is in control.